Reverend Ben Cooper's Podcast
Reverend Ben Coopers podcast, offers an inviting space for listeners to explore Christianity and spiritual growth with wisdom, humor, and a deep commitment to biblical truth. Through Rev. Ben's engaging conversations with guests, the podcast not only explores the timeless wisdom of the Bible but also tackles the pressing issues of life, faith, and hope in a way that is accessible, thought-provoking, and enriching. Whether you’re seeking spiritual nourishment, answers to life’s big questions, or simply a place to reflect on your faith, the Rev Ben podcast is a valuable resource on your journey.
In each episode, Rev. Ben guides listeners through profound theological reflections, personal stories, and practical insights drawn from the Bible and the broader Christian tradition.
Reverend Ben Cooper's Podcast
God's Work Through Imperfect People - (#1054 - CST)
Good morning. Good morning and welcome. Thank you for joining us here at Hashtag Christian Straight Talk and our Patreon family. We are just about to dive straight in and do our first podcast and our video recording, so we welcome you wherever you are across the earth. We thank you so much for joining us and streaming and sharing all this stuff out. But our Patreon family. Good morning and welcome. Good morning.
Speaker 2:Ben, hi, mate, it's great to be with the Patreon family, ben. Yeah, we want to create a community through hashtag Christian Straight Talk and we want to say to you out there today listen, if you're tired of church, tired of religion, then join us, because we're both the same. Join us on Straight Talk and we'll straight talk through, we'll cut through all the religion. We'll cut through all the nonsense, oh definitely.
Speaker 2:And we want to just create this family, this community where we look out for each other. Ben, that's what we want to do through straight talk it's pretty simple, isn't it?
Speaker 1:and we want to just say to anyone out there Simon's already said, as we just welcome you this morning and we say good morning across the Patreon family, we are blessed that you are linking in, walking with us, sharing in this ministry. What do we call this Patreon family? You're partnering with us, we're partnering with you, we're doing everything that we do and we're just about to dive into podcast, and we've been podcasting for many years now, haven't we three years?
Speaker 2:we have yeah, over three years we've been, we've been doing weekly podcasts and uh, so we got the feel of it then we got the feel of it we know what, we know where this stuff lands. And today, listen, we want to say to you wherever you are, look uh, never give up, ben no never, ever give up.
Speaker 2:We're with you. The straight talk family is with you, and to prove that, what we want to hit the ground running, this morning we're going to talk about imperfect people in the bible ben every one of them apart from jesus christ?
Speaker 1:yeah, every, everyone had a failing. Every one of them had a flaw, every one of them had a uh, an ankle tie to some form of sin or trouble, whatever it was. How can we pick these characters? I think, from genesis to revelation, you find imperfect people serving a perfect.
Speaker 2:God. Well, he uses them, ben, and the reason he uses them is because they have a heart for him. That's the reason, regardless of what they get up to, and we're going to go into that in a moment. So what we want to say to you out there, right off the bat, really, is that life may have pushed you down. You may have been told many times in your life that you can't do anything. People may have told you and if people tell you enough times, ben, that you, that you're rubbish at something and you're no good, then that'll stick. So it does stick and it'll drive your spirit down.
Speaker 2:But we want to say this morning that your spirit can rise and the father can use you. Amen, and the total surrender to jesus will give you a heart for the lord. Uh, ben, you know, uh, jesus knows you're not perfect. The father knows you're not perfect because he made you. But, as romans 8, 28 says, ben, and we know that, all things work together for the good of those who love god, to those who are called according to his purpose. What a beautiful scripture. All things work together for the good of those who love God, to those who are called according to his purpose.
Speaker 1:What a beautiful scripture. All things work together for the good. You know what the enemy meant for harm. God will turn it for good. So whatever is looking bad and down, you know what the enemy wanted for harm for that individual. God will turn it around.
Speaker 2:And all things work together for good when you've got Jesus on your side, when you've got Jesus in your car, when you've got Jesus driving away driving your car, and let's have a look. So, ben, let's have a look at some of the fathers' broken worries, and the first one we move into is of Father Abraham.
Speaker 1:Oh, Abraham, yeah.
Speaker 2:He's right, number one.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And he was a liar, and he was an adulterer, ben.
Speaker 1:Abraham, but he was called. He was called and he was chosen. Are you sure? Is that Bible correct what it says there? His life, his life, his life.
Speaker 2:He lied about his wife being his sister, didn't he? Yeah, yeah, on a couple of occasions, didn't he?
Speaker 1:He was really on the button with his own, so he was fearful then as well. Yeah, he was a fearful man, a man that tried everything that life offered him. He ducked and dived, but what does the Bible say about him? The Bible says he was righteous.
Speaker 2:He was a righteous man. Yeah, so that's in Genesis 16, genesis 20, you get all this. But the thing is with him, Ben, you know God had told him, right, god had told him. You know your wife will have a child and your ancestor sorry, you'll create. Ancestor, you'll create. There'll be more come from your stock than there will be grains of sand on the earth. But he didn't trust God, did he?
Speaker 1:No, he didn't trust God. He tried every way. So there comes an obedience issue there. It comes an issue of being obedient.
Speaker 2:Big time, so here we go.
Speaker 1:He's off the bat.
Speaker 2:Nothing's happening with his wife, sarah Sarah at the time, and then so she goes, oh why don't you? Sleep with my maidservant Hagar, and of course you know, I don't think Abraham had to be given a second chance.
Speaker 1:Oh right, if I got to.
Speaker 2:He was this young, very attractive young, and he slept with her. The Bible didn't say how many times he slept with her, but he slept with her enough times to produce a child. And you know, imagine a father. You've got to trust me, but he didn't. So then we have all this going on with Ishmael. Then Sarah gets pregnant, and so what does he do? What does God do with him? Right? So he has his own son, isaac. God says you've got to sacrifice him. God wanted to find out his heart. Where you stand.
Speaker 1:Where you stand? Where you stand, where's his heart? Will you go to the wire? Will you walk to the wire? In the book of James it says about Abraham James, chapter 2, verse 23,. It says and the scriptures were fulfilled. That says Abraham believed God. So he was a believer and it was counted to him as righteousness and he was called a friend of God. Even though all this activity, activity, all this stuff was going on, and you know that that that's that part of scripture that you brought up is really powerful, isn't it? Where he had to go and, um, he had to leave his servant at the base of the mountain and they was wandering. He said, dad, we've got the firewood, we've got this, we've got that, we've got the knife, but where's the sacrifice, dad? Where's the yeah? Where's the sacrifice, dad? Where's the yeah?
Speaker 2:where's the sheep? Where's the ram?
Speaker 1:Where's the ram? Where's the sacrifice? What did he say? Don't worry, son, God will provide.
Speaker 2:So when the rubber hit the road, he had the trust and faith in the Lord, didn't he? Because you can imagine that knife was getting raised, wasn't it that?
Speaker 1:knife was getting raised, wasn't it? That knife was?
Speaker 2:getting raised and suddenly Isaac is realised.
Speaker 1:I'm a sacrifice. He's on the altar, he's got the firewood all around, everything is happening. He lifts the knife and when you look at that, and the angel of the Lord had to call out Abram, abram, stop, the Lord will provide. The Lord will provide. And in the thicket there was a sacrificial animal. It was provided. It was provided. God always provides and whatever you are going through in your life, whatever you are finding, god uses imperfect people to get his perfect will done.
Speaker 2:Look at Rahab. Well, we're going to come on to that.
Speaker 1:You're jumping the gun. Sorry, sorry, sorry, we're going to come on to that. Come on to that. Yeah, you know you're jumping the gun, sorry sorry, sorry, let's slow down.
Speaker 2:The thing is, the big thing is what you said earlier, ben, is obedience and trust.
Speaker 1:Obedience and trust. And where does that sit with me as a believer?
Speaker 2:Obedience and trust.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's very. Oh, I We've got ask ourselves it's a journey and for every one of us believers in Christ Jesus being a born again believer, we've got our complete journey of faith. We are imperfect people that have been saved by a perfect Christ washed in the blood of Jesus. So you know, all have sinned and fallen short of that glory. The scripture is so clear in many places like that. But because of the sacrificial lamb at the cross of Calvary, we've been given hope and a future. And I think it's really great to reference these characters of the Bible and say do you know what? They slipped and they slid on the ice of life, but God still used them.
Speaker 2:When you look at.
Speaker 1:Abraham's life.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because he had a heart for the Lord, didn't he? He had a heart for God and he still used them, and I think they're great examples and encouragement.
Speaker 1:Encouragement, because we need encouraging. Because religion tells you you're worthless and you can't do. The kingdom of God tells you you can do. That's a very important point you make, doesn't?
Speaker 2:it.
Speaker 1:Religion says you're limited, they want to control you. They want to control you at Holy Communion time, at ministry time. You can't do it because we said that you can't. It's really important if you're out there and whoever you are, whatever means you're capturing this at this moment, we would really encourage you on the Patreon family. You know, never give up in your life, because all of us are imperfect and sometimes that can be difficult to embrace that we're imperfect but by the blood of Jesus we're right standing before him.
Speaker 2:And you know, sometimes I think church wants you to be perfect in certain places.
Speaker 1:It wants you to be squeaky clean coming in with….
Speaker 2:Bless and highly favoured, all that sort of stuff. But we are broken vessels. We are absolutely. But look what? When Abraham finally, you know, gave all his trust, look what he did with him. He just did amazing things with him, didn't he? Amazing things? God blessed him, yeah, and he became actually. Abraham is the father of three faiths, isn't he? So he's the father of the Muslim faith, because Ishmael was his son.
Speaker 2:He's the father of the Christian faith. He's also the father of the Jewish faith. So you know, this guy's such an important character, but he was flawed.
Speaker 1:He was flawed from day one, from day one. And do you know what that's really encouraging, that's really comforting to know that, through the Bible, god uses the imperfection to get his perfect will done and whatever, if you're at work, you're at home perfection to get his perfect will done and and whatever if you're at work, you're at home and you've got things breaking out in your life. Always be encouraged that god always uses and we'll use it in the biblical term he uses the lowly, uses the despised things of the world to nullify the things that are not.
Speaker 2:Well, totally yeah, and you can. Doesn't matter how far you fall. No, you're not. Doesn't matter how far you fall, jesus is always're not. It doesn't matter how far you fall, jesus is always there to pick you up again.
Speaker 1:Jesus will capture you carry you, nurture you, you know, wipe your tears, strengthen you. There is always hope when you are a follower of Jesus Christ. You will find from Genesis, right from when they took from the tree, because before they took from the tree we have perfect human beings before they touched. And what did they do? They went against god's word, they went against the instruction of god. So it's clear when you go against the instruction, you're going to meet resistance, you're going to meet trouble, you're going to meet doubts and fears. When you go against the word, you're going to find that there is a resilient pressure and a push on you. But when you surrender still imperfect, because we're human beings, but the inner us, the inner us, the inner us.
Speaker 2:And because you've given over control of your life to Jesus Christ. So Ben. The second one is Noah. Really Ben, wow, because Noah it says in Genesis 9, 2, he said he got drunk, he was a drunkard. What on Stella?
Speaker 1:Prosecco. I wonder what was out there. What did he get drunk on? What was this? It must have been the wine.
Speaker 2:Ben, it must have been the wine. It must have been the wine, it must have been a bit of vino, do you know? So he got drunk on the cheap vino and it says he was uncovered and his sons had to cover him up.
Speaker 1:Completely naked, so exposure.
Speaker 2:He was exposed, was lying there and his boys had to cover him up. The thing has been, and God went on to use him powerfully, didn't he? And how did God?
Speaker 1:use this man. He spoke directly to him. He said build yourself an ark. Build yourself an ark. I want you to do this. And it says Noah was a righteous man. Again, from the text we have, you go from Abraham, you go to Noah. These characters, even if you quickly. I just mentioned Lot. I know we're not on Lot, but even Lot was recognized as a righteous man, but he went and lived in the gateway of Sodom and Gomorrah, abraham's descendant, abraham's family, lot. He just decided to when they said look the cattle, the sheep, the herd, we're getting too big. We can't hold this camp that we've got at the moment. So what way do you want to go, lot? Where do you want to go? Where do you want to go, lot? What do you want? There's the green pastures, there's all that over there. Lovely, lovely, hang on. He went. No, I Again.
Speaker 2:Another flawed character and God. Our father used Noah to save the world, didn't he really? Yeah, because he saved the world with the animals. And there's a wonderful thing out in Kentucky They've built a life-size model.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I've heard about that and seen a bit of that Just absolutely amazing. Looks fantastic.
Speaker 2:And, like they said, you know he probably didn't even have full-size animals, he probably had smaller animals. You know as much as they were growing up it wouldn't be a huge bull, elephant or something. He probably took a little male, took in the sensible sizes, yeah, yeah. But there you go. You know he's used them again and still in Genesis, ben, a big one really is Jacob, jacob, you know.
Speaker 2:Jacob was the father of the Jewish nation, wasn't he, you know? And who God made a covenant with? Look, but he was a second. He wouldn't buy a second-hand car for Jacob because he was a slippery character.
Speaker 1:He probably had no engine in it. He was a slippery character. No seatbel, no engine in it, no seatbelts.
Speaker 2:Yeah, he stole his brother's birthright, persuaded by his mother, Rebecca.
Speaker 1:These are strong characters in the Word of God. These are rocks to our faith that we look at. These are in the Word. The Word is written about them, for them, around them, everything to do. They're characters, they're life story. God called them but they've got flaws. They're imperfect, imperfect people within the scripture and I just find it absolutely fascinating to look at these different characters. So when you look at Jacob, he's the character that said I'm going to hang on to you, I ain't going till you bless me totally, I, I ain't leaving this arena. And it says that he wrestled with god. He wrestled with god, he, he held on to god. I find this, this text, so beautiful and so encouraging. I'm going to hang on to you and I'm not going to let you go. Not that that he was stronger than God, but God had to strike his hip Strike his hip, strike his hip.
Speaker 1:So you could look at this like this we have an imperfect character with imperfections in his life. He was a wheeler, a dealer. He was a real unusual character in the time that he lived, but he recognized the power of God, which is very comforting, and he said I'm going to hang on to, I'm not going to leave you until you bless me. To hold onto God that much and for God to strike him on the hip. I believe this that when you really hold onto God, there's a marking on you. There's a marking on you and within you that you you that you never had before you went into the arena of God, because if you want to hang on to God, you're going to come out with a form of a touch from.
Speaker 2:God, it's your heart in it, it's where your heart is, it touches your heart. Look, so Jacob married. There was so much dodginess going on between him and LeBan wasn't there. You know, leban was equally as dodgy. As you know, these guys were both manipulators. And then so he marries. He wanted to marry. Was it Rachel he wanted?
Speaker 1:to marry Rachel.
Speaker 2:But LeBan made him marry Leah, you know. And then he had to marry Rachel again. So Rachel was the mother of listen, this is just. It just gets beyond the pub. Rachel was the mother of Joseph, right, but before that, what did she do? She stole little gods or something from her dad's place. And when her dad caught up with them and he said it was enough that you left without saying goodbye, but you've stolen she pretended she had a period and was sitting on a saddle where the gods were underneath. So she just said to him she's stolen them, but she was still the mother of Joseph.
Speaker 1:So when you look at the depth of these characters, what they would do and what they've done to their family. They legged and what they'd done to their family. They legged it, they stole from them, they ducked, they dived, but God used them.
Speaker 2:God still used them. And look at her. And then she. So she was the mother of Joseph. And look at Joseph himself. He was very proud, wasn't he? Because he had you know, look at my coat and he really gave it to his brothers.
Speaker 1:He got that blessing from his dad and his brothers turned on him, turned on him and he was abused.
Speaker 2:He was abused, he was sold into slavery.
Speaker 1:But look how god used him, so god used you've got all these characters very quickly, at the very beginning of the of the text, right early within in the text, that they are so imperfect. The church wouldn't even have chosen. They were. No, they were. Religion would never have chosen. Religion would have looked at them and gone. We're going to disregard them characters because there's no way we can use A, b, c and D. It's impossible because they don't fit our structure and our criteria. But God uses God uses.
Speaker 2:You're exactly right.
Speaker 1:God uses.
Speaker 2:And if this book, this Bible, was written on purely by man not. Holy Spirit revelation. These people wouldn't be in there, would they? They wouldn't be on the page? No, because these would be. And isn't it funny? I mean, we're going right off the skull, but isn't it funny that the Bible says that when the Antichrist comes back, he's going to be this perfect person for peace?
Speaker 1:Imitating Christ, absolutely. Stunning looking guy that brings the world to peace. Perfect person, peace Absolutely.
Speaker 2:Imitating Christ. Absolutely An imitator, you know looking guy who brings the world to peace but has an ulterior motive. So God is using these amazing people. Look, you know. Look at Moses. Right, he was a murderer, ben he killed an Egyptian.
Speaker 1:I've got a smile just thinking about all these characters.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Moses and he had a shutter and a staff.
Speaker 1:That's all he had.
Speaker 2:But he killed an Egyptian, didn't he?
Speaker 1:He was a murderer. He was brought up in a different household. He knew where he'd come from. He lied, he'd done this, he'd done everything. All these characters can tick every box. They tick every box of imperfection, but God used them to get his work done.
Speaker 2:Well, look what he did with Moses. You know, he led him. Moses, time and time again, said I'm not, I can't do this, I can't do this, and God at one side the father at one point he was going to top him, wasn't he? You're out At one point he was going to say right, I've had enough.
Speaker 1:I've had enough of you. I've had enough of you. But his countenance changed. So, when you look at this character, he was a murderer and all the other stuff that went from that, but he sat in the presence of God at the burning bush and God had a conversation with a murderer. God had a conversation with a man that was imperfect in many of his life, with his physical, within his voice, within his lifestyle and everything. But God uses the real-life characters and do you know what God creates us? God has molded us, god has shaped us. God knows our character and we've got to be so careful that we don't become so religious and so rigid. We lose our identity of who we are.
Speaker 2:I think it's a great point. Because he sees us Seriously. Patreon family, listen to what Ben said, Because God puts inside us what he wants us to use. So if you're a bit feisty, if you've got a bit about you, then if you use it in the right way that's what the Lord wants, doesn't he? He wants that Now. Both me and Ben, we love encouraging people.
Speaker 1:Oh, encouragement.
Speaker 2:We love encouraging people and we love encouraging you out there, and so that's what we're about. And so Moses had a brother, Aaron, right, and this guy was so he stood with Moses, but when he was on his own he was so weak-willed.
Speaker 1:Let's melt the gold. Where's your brother? Don't worry, he's with God. Don't worry, they can't see what we're doing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you do what you like.
Speaker 1:Let's melt the gold, let's have parties and orgies, let's do all that. Moses trots back down, sees his brother up to all sorts of things and must think what in the world Moses up that place the burning bush in the presence of God, his countenance changes. He must have come back down and thought what in the world are they up to? Well, aaron was the chief priest wasn't he when you….
Speaker 2:And what happened was you know, I think Moses made him ground it down. He made him drink it, didn't he? In the end? And I mean, look at that, look at that, he made him drink it. He was going to kill a few people, but sadly, aaron lost two of his sons, didn't he? Yeah?
Speaker 1:But sadly.
Speaker 2:Aaron lost two of his sons, didn't he? Because, they did the wrong thing. So you know, at that time God wasn't hanging about.
Speaker 1:God never messes about. But thank God for the cross, that I wasn't birthed in the Old Testament. Thank God that I'm in the New Testament. Praise the Lord. Thank you, jesus, for that one.
Speaker 2:You mentioned Rahab, and she comes in the book of Joshua. Lied through her teeth. She was a prostitute, wasn't she? She was a prostitute, but lied through her teeth to protect.
Speaker 1:The two spies that were sent out. It's interesting, isn't it? Where did them spies go? The first place they went was to Rahab's. Yeah, that was always on their sat-nav. So had they been there before? What did they know about this woman? What had gone on? Because it says they went straight to Rahab. And what I find fascinating with this woman is that she has a blatant conversation with the king's men and go, they're not here. I'll tell you what. They're not here. If you're quick enough, you'll capture them. And she had just put them on the top of the roof, covered them with flax and said to them and she'd done a deal. I find it absolutely phenomenal. Do you know what I mean? That she'd done a deal, done a deal. I'll help you if you help me.
Speaker 2:So that begs the question, doesn't it Ben?
Speaker 1:You know. Is there any time where we are completely righteous and holy and can lie? Is there any time? Is there any time you look?
Speaker 2:at the two sides of that coin. She lied because?
Speaker 1:why? Because, but she also said I know your god, we are in fear of you lot, because we know what God has been doing. And I tell you what. I'll help you if you help me.
Speaker 2:I mean there must be. I mean, you can imagine nowadays, can't you? You know, if you've got a couple of Christian brothers in a war-torn country and you're hiding them and they come in, what are you going to say? What are you going to say?
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, there they are. There they are, look, shoot them Automatically. I them. And what are you going to say? What are you going to say, oh yeah, there they are. There they are, look, shoot them. Yeah, because you, automatically. I think I've got to be completely honest here with our patreon family. If that was me, I would have done do the same thing. I'd hide them under the sofa, I'd hide them anywhere and say don't know where they are, don't know what you're talking about. Yeah, it's strange, isn't it? The way that you would react when mortality is in the arena and when you've got to save yourself and save your family. Because she said I'm going to do a deal with you. If you help us, I will help you, I'll get you out of here, but you've got to bring my family with you.
Speaker 2:But here's the thing just staying on right for a second Ben, when you've got these men who must have come in, they must have been fully well-armed, you know and they're looking for where there are these spies. Now she has convinced them, so….
Speaker 1:She's very convincing.
Speaker 2:Is the Holy Spirit speaking through her?
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:Giving her that strength Because you know, in the natural you'd be shaking, wouldn't you?
Speaker 1:If you see a handful of soldiers that was glistening in armour and armoury with swords drawn, hyped up, adrenaline rushing, looking to kill, looking to get these two guys. And she uses through conversation a way. How did she and what was she and why was she able to manipulate these guys? What was that? Was the hand of God on her? Was the presence of God?
Speaker 2:with her. You've got to say it must have been Ben, because in her own strength, why did they listen to her?
Speaker 1:But Rahab's house.
Speaker 2:Because she must have been well known as a prostitute.
Speaker 1:Exactly. And why did the spies go directly to her? Why didn't they go to the travel lodge and she was protected? Why didn't they go to the premier? Yeah, why did they choose this lady?
Speaker 2:Well, they didn't choose. I guess the Lord chose her, didn't he?
Speaker 1:Yeah, you're right there because she's very instrumental and she is mentioned in the genealogy of Christ Jesus in the book of Matthew, chapter 1. She's clearly mentioned and through her comes that other great character. When you look at all the stuff that goes on how God uses, you know we're coming to the end of the drumbeat on this, this podcast. We're ramping up the 27 minutes and we just want to encourage you. We could talk forever, we could just go forever looking at these characters and, as you're with us, we're going to.
Speaker 2:We're going to continue. We're going to continue. We're going to do the second podcast. We're looking at more of these characters, but it's for the second tier, ben. That's what it's for. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:So we thank God for your life and you've been sharing everything and we just want to encourage you as we just bow out of this one, our Patreon family. We just want to say thank you so much from the very bottom of our heart for you, for linking in, subscribing, following whatever terminology we use and however that is used. We are so blessed to know that you are sowing into what God has put on our hearts to do and to be able to help us to do what we do, and together, because we partner together, you know, and we walk together. May God bless you and strengthen you. You know, this is really interesting. Simon the characters of the Bible.
Speaker 2:It's an amazing thing and, uh, what will will be shown you further down, the further down the line will be shown you exactly what your subscription to us helps to bring really to yes, to the community here where we are and uh yeah, which is really important and and you're going to love it and, um, you're going to love the content we're going to bring and we, we just want you know suggestions from you what we can going to bring, and we just want you know suggestions from you what we can do more maybe to what do you want from us?
Speaker 1:What do you want from?
Speaker 2:us. What can we do? Because we just want to create this through the Lord, this Patreon family of Straight Talk, and we want to straight talk and cut through stuff, but we want to, more than ever, we want to support you because we're in this together.
Speaker 1:We, more than ever, we want to support you because we're in this together, we're walking together, we're united. There is no denominational line. Denominations are gone. This is a church family. This is a kingdom family.
Speaker 2:Kingdom family. All are welcome, Ben.
Speaker 1:God bless you wherever you are. We'll see you next time. We'll see you next time. We'll see you next time. Patreon family, god bless, have a great day In Jesus' name, amen. Thank you.
